Fat Bodies are Not Evidence

Consider the following true stories:

A doctor tells a fat patient that they need to eat less and exercise more without asking them what they eat or how much they exercise.  When they say that they do eat healthy and exercise instead of asking for details the doctor says “That can’t possibly be true.”

A fat person goes to a personal trainer, explains that they practice the Health at Every Size(r) method and want to increase their strength, stamina, and flexibility. The trainer ignores their request and devises a weight loss plan.

A fat person is out for ice cream with their thin friends.  Ignoring the fact that the thin people are eating the same thing someone walks up and tells the fat person “This is why you’re fat.”

Paula Deen eats a hamburger on a cruise and a website puts up a poll asking if that’s “ok” or if she “should only be seen eating healthier foods” (a poll that the Rolls not Trolls Group totally fat bombed by the way, when last I looked 84% of respondents said that people should mind their own business)

A fat child is told that he shouldn’t have any cake at his own birthday party because he shouldn’t ever have any sweets until he is thin.

Parents are accused of child abuse because one of their kids is fat. Even though these parents are officially labeled “child abusers” and the fat child is moved to foster care, social services allows their thin child to remain in the home of these so-called “abusers”

What do all of these situations have in common? If you answered “They are all effed up” you are totally right but it goes beyond that.

Fat bodies are seen as “evidence”.  People try to claim that our bodies are evidence of unhealthy behaviors, lack of willpower, lack of self-care.  Then they claim that this evidence is compelling enough to make it ok to target us for shame, stigma and humiliation “for our own good”.

Even more damaging, fat people start to internalize this message thinking “If I’m fat then no matter how healthy my habits are I must be doing something wrong.  I deserve to be treated poorly and have my body and choices treated like public property.”

This is just not true.  Fat bodies are not public property, they are not evidence, and they are not a sign that we need someone to step in and tell us how to take care of ourselves. First because nobody can tell what our habits are based on our body size.  Second because our health is our decision – we each get to choose how highly to prioritize our health and what path we want to take to get there, with the understanding that we may be limited by the resources that are available to us.

If people really want to do something about health they will start concentrating on making sure that everyone has access to the foods that they would choose to eat, safe movement options that they enjoy, and appropriate evidence-based health care.  Claiming to be for health while running a ridiculous “one shamed fatty at a time” campaign sounds a whole lot like being a bully and then blaming the bullied.  I don’t know about you, but those bullies can’t have my lunch money any more.

Slightly off-topic, I am now blogging on issues of body image, beauty, and women’s health for NBC’s iVillage.  My first post (about the intersection of body image and high heels) can be found here! Since I’m new it would be awesome and helpful if you wanted to check it out and comment!

This blog is supported by its readers rather than corporate ads.  If you feel that you get value out of the blog, can afford it, and want to support my work and activism, please consider a paid subscription or a one-time contribution.  The regular e-mail subscription (available at the top right hand side of this page) is still completely free.   Thanks for reading! ~Ragen

Published in: on January 28, 2012 at 9:31 am  Comments (37)  

37 CommentsLeave a comment

  1. totally fat bombed


  2. And yet strangely, this gal is not used as an example, because her body doesn’t fit the expectation of a person who eats nothing but chicken nuggets:


    (my she has a lot of teeth for someone who should have a severe vitamin deficiency…)

  3. Thanks for this post–it really gets at the heart of how people’s bodies are viewed as evidence. I come from the too-thin side of this argument. I was diagnosed with anorexia nervosa in 2003 and what frightened me was how people viewed my starving body as evidence of incredible good health, discipline, and success. Something is seriously, deeply, incredibly, (insert more adjectives here) wrong with our society when we attach these sorts of moral evaluations to bodies.

    Thanks again for the awesomeness of this blog, and keep up the good work of spreading the truth!

    • OK, and I would like to now revise what I said–when I said “too-thin” I meant “too thin for what my body needs to be.” Don’t want to judge people who have bodies that just exist that way!

  4. I’ve got a notion that a lot of people believe that the actual fat person isn’t as real as their imagined thin version of that person, and this makes it easy to mistreat fat people. Does it seem plausible that this is the underlying belief?

    • Hmmm, that’s an interesting point. I’m not sure though. I don’t know that strangers on the street or a new doc who’s never seen you before has really taken the time to imagine a thin version of you that is worthy of respect. I might consider that family members who maybe knew you when you were smaller might be mistreating the fat you to try and get the thin you back (vowing that they would never mistreat the thin you…) I agree that, in some way, fat people aren’t considered “real” (as evidenced by the headless fatties used in media stories about the obesity epidemic). Other groups suffer from this too, look at all the headless women in advertising. Because women differ from the “norm” (maleness), they are considered not real people either. Still, I have to look inside myself and admit that I have a thin version of me that I consider ME. When I dream or imagine myself, I am often smaller than I am now. When I look in the mirror or see a picture, I am sometimes surprised by how big I actually am. But this is related to age too, my inner self is often younger and has longer hair (like I did in my 20’s). So, maybe it is just more evidence pointing to how our brains play tricks on us, how we are slow to accept change, and how disconnected from our physical bodies most of us really are…
      thanks for the thought provoking question Nancy :)

    • I think they believe fat people aren’t people, however I don’t believe they imagine the thin person underneath. Because if they did, they wouldn’t see us as subhuman.

      I doubt that racists look at a black person and see their inner white person.

      • If you use one of the wider definitions of racism, then when a white person says to a black person, “I don’t think of you as black”, I think the white person is doing something of the sort.

  5. Oh I got a good one for ya Ragen,
    So I was seeing a Migraine specialist the other day..and while testing my reflexes she asks out of NO WHERE “SO how is your sleep apnea being treated” My Reply” I don;t HAVE sleep apnea” Her reply ” Are you sure” me “Yes I had a sleep study done not that long ago and there was no evidence that I even SNORED more or less sleep apneia” And this women is not HELL BENT on getting that sleep study to prove me wrong. I kindly gave her the name and address of the hospital because I have a copy and I know what it says. She also informed me that Psychiatrists do NOT work, their methods are flawed and a Kenesiologist can fix up my PTSD just like that (snapping fingers included to demonstrate how fast Post Traumatic Stress Disorder can be cured.) And I am supposed to let THIS woman who is ore concerned with the size of my underwear put upwards of 20 needles in my head to treat neuralgia…F that noise..I nearly slapped her right then and there. She might as well have asked me ” SO how’s the type 2 Diabetes going for ya” (which I also do not have) but seriously..I have had Drs mention weight but never outright ASSUME that I have something I don’t….It still angers me to think about.

    • My OB asked me if I snored (probably to find out if I had sleep apnea too). Asked me WHILE he had his hand up my hoo-ha at my 6 week post partum appointment. My husband was still in South Korea with our older daughter so my response was, “I don’t know, so far I haven’t heard any complaints from the baby.” That got him.

      • yeah I had an OBGYN that was WAY too concerned with my weight as well. He told me I should eat half of what I was currently, I told him “then I wouldn’t be eating anything at all” I had an eating disorder at the time, and there IS a point in starvation where ANY food your body receives is automatically turned into fat, and being that I was JUST rescued from one of the situations that GAVE me PTSD where I was to cook for a family and not eat, then was punished physically FOR eating, I fought back with this OBGYN many years ago. I told him flat out ” Look Buddy, it’s your job to take a gander, make sure nothing is growing where it shouldn’t be, do an oil change and replace the wiper fluid (vag car metaphor in case I confused anyone there) And that’s IT I HAVE a Dr currently that is treating me for my EATING DISORDER which is me not eating enough as opposed to eating to much, so back off!”

        I swear OBGYNs and Neurologists must be bored in their specialty because they ALWAYS have to say something about some other part of your body.

      • Lyssa, I still suspect that he was pissed at me because he couldn’t convince me to go for a repeat cesarean and I had had a successful VBAC despite being morbidly obese. If I had been there from the beginning of my pregnancy, there is no way I would have stayed with this guy but I had been in South Korea prior to that until 30 weeks so was kind of limited in who I could have. I really felt he was trying to recoup some of the losses from my not having a cesarean. He was telling me I should considering breast reduction surgery (mind you, six weeks post partum, NURSING mother and nursing baby was out in the waiting room SCREAMING her head off), then it went to weight and how I needed to look into surgery if I couldn’t get the weight off with diet and exercise. I never went back to him. I went to the local family planning clinic instead. At least they never say anything about my weight after they get it.

    • Ask for a referral to another migraine specialist because this overbearing nutjob is NOT doing her job – she’s doing everyone else’s! And then write her a letter letting her know exactly why you are finding another doctor.

      What a …. well, I won’t say it, but I’ll think it loudly!

      • I’m fat and had a really bad snoring problem and (self diagnosed) sleep apnea. I mean there were times when I would consciously wake up struggling to breathe.

        I thought it was all due to my weight. Then I started a treatment regimen for my thyroid and the apnea went away. I still snore, but not nearly as badly.

        I’ve lost, maybe, 5 lbs, but only in the last month or so. The sleep problems cleared up about after the 1st month of treatment (about 3 months ago).

        The theory is that hypo causes muscle weakness (including the muscles in the throat) which is the cause of the apnea. it also causes weakness in the muscles inside the arteries, which is why hypertension often accompanies hypo. It fucks with sugar metabolism and can contribute to insulin resistance.

        Hypo also hobbles the metabolism and causes weight gain.

        But no, apnea is cause solely by fat. Yep. :eyeroll:

      • Yes I WILL be getting another Dr. The ONLY reason I went to her (and surprisingly EVERYONE in this practice I have seen before for one reason or another and have left PISSED at the at times downright RUDE behavior, aka, being held waiting for 2 hours PAST my apt to be seen for 5 min by the HEAD physician and then rushed out because at the time I didn’t have health insurance) Anyway I digress, this is a practice that is close by and can give the treatment that I need. My regular neurological pain management specialist can’t do the procedure under my current insurance. Side not this is in down town Clearwater(Florida), and I am not trying to Offend anyone, But we are starting to suspect that this practice of Drs are Scientologists. Religion is a personal choice, but when your job intersects with lets say someone who is treated for Psychiatric problems and your religion doesn’t believe in psychiatry or mental illness..there creates a problem. Oh not that it was any of her business, but I was probably more fit then she. I have done 7 performances in 6 months Post op from back to back Brain surgeries..I think after that I get to pretty much be whatever the hell size I want HOO-RAAHH!! :)

  6. Heh.. Frame of a 180lb man, stomach of a 350lbman.. average out to 285.. and buggered if anything I do changes it.. seems to be significantly linked to my genetics..

  7. So true. Fat bodies are seen as evidence…and IF, god forbid, they happen to have a weight correlated disease (like Paula), it’s their fault and they deserve pure wrath, condemnation, and disbeief. My aunt exercises 5 days a week and was told by her doctor “if you exercised that often, your cholesterol would be a lot lower. These numbers are not saying that.” Sadly my aunt said her doctor was not wrong for saying that because “probably a lot of people do actually lie, she’s just doing her job.” Also I remember as a young child, maybe 7, where our music teacher told us a story about a fat lady eating a salad on a plane next to her. She informed us that people like that are “closet eaters and eat more when they are alone.” Thinking back on that I feel so angry. Never mind having your own predjudiced beliefs based on ZERO evidence but how dare you pass that on to young chidren? And yet that’s what we’re doing more than ever lately – Telling children how scary and awful and deathly it is to be fat and what it means about you if you grow up to be fat. Makes me sad and makes me even more inspired to be active in these communities and stand up for what I believe in. Unfortunately I’m a lot braver on the internet than i am in real life when people say stuff…

  8. I am currently on a long term calorie restricted diet and not losing weight. I am about to be tested because I actually have started gaining weight on 1200 calories a day, and have cut back to 800-1000 calories while awaiting tests. I am a man, 6’1″ tall.

    I started to gain weight when I was 16 years old. I have eaten less than just about anyone I know for decades and have been moderately successful at keeping my weight under control, though I started to again a lot of weight about ten years ago inexplicably. I don;t know about other people, but I do know my situation is bizarre. My doctor said that it is not unusual for a woman to eat 1,200 calories a day and not lose any weight at all. Of course I am a 6′-1″ man who weighs in excess of 250 lbs, but that is beside the point.

    I have always been aware of my problem with easily gaining weight, but I also know that no one who doesn’t live me can believe that I seriously do not eat.

  9. GAh! Lindsay, you totally got me, I have said that line about “closet eaters” before! Problem is, I have been known to eat stuff that I’m “not supposed to” when I’m alone so I assumed that other fatties did too!
    Ragen, maybe you can help with this question. I don’t always take care of myself. I do overeat on rough days and sometimes retreat from life’s hardships by secretly eating. How can I present myself as “okay” if this is true? Do I just defend myself on the premise that I have a right to do with my body as I like, including sometimes indulging in unhealthy eating behaviors? Or, maybe I should remember that thin people probably do the same thing but no one makes a big deal of it? Ugg, it’s these types of questions that make me feel like I deserve the label of out of control bad fatty :( Looking forward to seeing other people’s take on this…

    • Allison,

      I’m not Ragen, but I’m like you in that I sometimes eat stuff that is “forbidden” and sometimes I hide it from my the people around me. When the urge to beat myself up for these behaviors comes over me, I just remind myself to be gentle with my own feelings. I cannot expect other people to be kind of me if I can’t even be kind to myself.

      The fact is that it’s nobody’s business if you or I are eating these things we’re not “supposed” to be eating. To steal from Ragen, no one gets to be the boss of your underpants except you. If I eat well and take care of myself 5 out of 7 days, I remind myself to celebrate those 5 days instead of the 2 that I didn’t do as well. But also keep in mind that these are my own goals, I don’t set them for anyone else and I don’t let anyone else set mine for me.

      I hope that helps. =)

    • Do you think thin people DON’T overeat on rough days or sometimes retreat from life’s hardships by secretly eating?

      Do you think thin people ALWAYS take care of themselves?

      Do you think thin people have the right to do with their bodies as they like, including sometimes indulging in unhealthy eating behaviors?

      According to your last paragraph, you don’t think these things. Or, perhaps, you subconsciously DO and need to remind yourself not to.

      The only thing that make you an “out of control fatty” is your insistence on beating yourself up for behavior you would excuse in a thin person.

      Repeat after me:
      “I am ALLOWED to eat what I want, and as much or as little as I want.”

      “I am ALLOWED to eat solely for comfort, or because it’s there, or because I like it, or because I’m hungry, or because I’m bored.”

      “I am ALLOWED to spend the day on the couch if I want.”

      “I am ALLOWED to exercise if I want.”

      “I am ALLOWED to wear a bathing suit.”

      “I am ALLOWED to exist exactly as I am, RIGHT NOW; not as who I MIGHT be in some vague, nebulous future.”

    • Um, whoever said you have to be perfect? Not being perfect isn’t a reason to be shamed or shunned. You are still “okay” – as in, you are still a human being who deserves to be treated with respect. You’re only a “bad fattie” if you’re kicking puppies, bullying little kids, or stealing Salvation Army donation kettles when you have a bad day. Eating is not a crime.

      If you’re not happy with how you’re treating yourself, then work on it because you deserve to be happy with your life. Just don’t come at it from a place of guilt and disrespecting yourself. If you are happy, then it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.

      • Right Kris, If I don’t like how I currently deal with stress, kicking my own butt isn’t going to help, it’s gonna stress me out ;) I do often consult professionals to help with emotional issues but for some reason I have latched onto whether I am stress eating or not as a way to judge whether I am “getting better” or “dealing with life”. I’m sure it’s helpful to keep in mind but it’s not the only way to tell if I’m emotionally and mentally sound. Unfortunately, I have encountered the idea that OBVIOUSLY, if someone has a weight issue they have mental and emotional issues that they are not dealing with or failing at dealing with! Again, the body is being used as evidence! This idea that you cannot judge someone’s happiness or stress level by their weight is kinda radical to my thinking… but I like it ;)

      • This post about how to do emotional eating in a healthy and helpful way might be useful: http://www.fatnutritionist.com/index.php/lesson-four-emotional-eating/

        I think that everybody who doesn’t spend their life on a beach with someone bringing them pina coladas finds ways to deal with stress that may not be perfectly healthy. I also think that if you eat for comfort in a way that doesn’t make you feel sick or involve eating things that harm you (like ice cream if you’re lactose intolerant), it’s not a bad thing. If you’re doing all the “competent-eating” stuff of giving yourself regular, balanced meals and snacks and paying attenetion to how foods make you feel, it will all balance out in the long run. Maybe you eat a big bowl of ice cream after a bad day, then aren’t as hungry for breakfast the next day, or want less sweets and dairy and more protein and veggies. But it evens out better if you let it than if you try to force yourself to eat well.

        I also think it’s worth reminding yourself that the decisions you make in any given moment are you doing the best you can with what you have. If you don’t like the decision, or if the decision makes you feel icky, then you can try to do things differently next time, but you shouldn’t beat yourself up for it.

        As a personal example, when I was trying, unsuccessfully, to find a doctor who would treat my thyroid issues, I developed a lovely caffeine dependency. I’ve now weaned myself down to one cup of coffee a day, but it was pretty rough. But when I’m tempted to give myself grief for that, I remember that it was the best tool I had to get through my life at the time. Being addicted to caffeine beats the heck out of being dead because you fell asleep at the wheel, or being fired because you fell asleep at work. I also had no way to know, at the time, that I’d become that dependent on caffeine. Certainly I’ve known plenty of people who caffeine doesn’t seem to effect. They can and have gone off their Mountain Dew and Dr. Pepper without any ill effect.

        I think you have to look at the coping decisions you make in the context of where you were when you made them, rather than trying to hold yourself to some hypothetical perfect standard.

        • Thanks Kelly for your great post, plenty of stuff to think about, but it fits with what I tend to do anyway, great minds think alike and all that! Thank you also for the comment about the situation I had on Saturday, not sure I feel “brave” enough to e-mailing or calling her, but will keep in mind, especially in the light of probably having to see her in London this coming Sunday. It really helps to hear other like minded people’s perspective as it confirms you are thinking/acting on the right track, what a great blog this is. Marion, UK

  10. Thanks PM Pange and Jill. To Jill: Well, I was raised in this culture and have internalized a lot of it’s negative messages, that’s why I’m here, to try and undo that. But first, I have to realize what’s going in inside of me head and YES, maybe I do excuse those behaviors in thin people because they are thin. Because they are thin, they get the reward of eating whatever they want, whereas I am supposed to be punishing myself day in and day out for failing to be thin! Also, I’ve been taught all my life that I’m fat because I eat too much and too often. So, logic (ha!) tells us that thin people must be doing the opposite. Even though I’ve known some thin people who can put it away, I attributed their thinness to a high metabolism, increased exercise or just natural thinness (things I felt I do not have and could never have). So yeah! :) You got me. I have a whole lotta crazy talk running my head around food and weight. Luckily, I have found blogs like Ragen’s and I’m finally deciding to take this body positive message to heart. But just like any other new behavior or belief, It’s going to take a lot of time and repetition to cancel out the old messages. I think repeating your affirmations about what I am allowed to do will help :) Thank you both for the feedback! :)

    • I was raised in this culture to so I get where you are coming from. I was just kicking your ass. ;)

      • dangit! I wish this system would pick a Facebook picture and stick with it!

  11. With you – I hate this attitude. It’s SO destructive to people.

  12. I was thinking about the other side of this just yesterday – that thin bodies are also not evidence. I made the mistake of reading the comments (don’t read the comments!!!) on an article about Stacey Irvine, the 17 year old who eats only chicken nuggets and collapsed, needing hospitalization. It featured a few pictures of her and SO MANY of the commenters were saying things like, “she’s obviously not that unhealthy, I mean, look at her” and “if this was true, she’d be obese”. Mostly it was the “she’s not that unhealthy” stuff that got to me – she collapsed. That’s a sign of poor health.

    Usual disclaimer about how she doesn’t actually owe it to anybody to be healthy, etc, it’s her health and she can treat it how she wants.

  13. I really like your take on this whole issue, and am really interested in what you have to say about the whole weight & food issue. As a person with a history of eating disorders, I would like to contend that
    bodies in general are not public property, thin, fat or anything in between…. because people seem to think that they have a right to comment on your body and habits regardless of what your body looks like. God knows, I’ve certainly had my fair share of negative comments and I am pretty average in the weight department. And consider all those terrible comments that various celebrities get about how they must have some eating disorder or something because they have lost weight after the same magazine wrote a week earlier that they were getting fat…

  14. Allison, thanks for your replies to Pange and Jill(I think)that helped me as I do sometimes find myself thinking if it’s ok that I do sometimes “overindulge”(whatever that means?)despite the fact that most days and regularly I eat healthily, not overdoing it and walk whenever pain and my disability allows(sometimes pushing myself).
    I had a horrible situation yesterday with someone commenting about my size/weight/fitness/what food I ate, I can never think of right thing to say at the time&I was in this person’s house, so felt I couldn’t due to manners! She is not someone I am friends with and my first instinct on meeting her some years back(about people I’m usually right)was that she was overly bossy and not my type of person. I’m in an international women’s friendship organization, that’s based in the UK and some people organize local events on a bi-monthly basis and I attended the one closest to where I currently live yesterday, where this woman was rude in my view. I do attend a London one also and my first instinct was right about that one, as the women there are more respectful and generous generally.

    There were only a few of us at the event in this woman’s house and after the meal(everyone brings or makes a main course or a dessert to share)most left and there was me and another woman left. the hostess offered to make us tea or coffee and we were given the wrong one but carried on drinking it as it didn’t really matter, but she made an issue out of that and called us “stupid” for not mentioning it, so perhaps we could see the writing on the wall! The hostess used to be a children’s nurse, is now retired and from what I can gather, suffers from major back problems from her previous work and has Osteoarthritis, which I also have. We got on to the subject of exercise, mobility and food somehow and I said I had stopped going on an organized “health walk” for various reasons, but still walked when I could on my own. She then started suddenly lecturing me in quite an unpleasant way, that I should be doing much more fitness, “why didn’t I go to a gym”, because she made an effort to and also swimming, pilates, despite not liking it much. Then we got to the food/weight issue and she said she was “battling” with hers, partly due to the medical profession I think and said I had put on weight in last few years(I hadn’t realised!!)and that was bad and it was affecting MY arthritis, asked if I ate bread and potatoes and that was “bad” of course, and so on. I was a bit stunned I admit as I wasn’t expecting that at that time. It went on in this vein, with me stupidly trying to justify/explain myself in a way, but what I didn’t get to reply to as I started to get ready to leave at that stage as did the other woman. She ranted about doctors/medical profession not treating you if you were overweight, yet just over 2 years I had a hip replacement in a different area, I was more or less the same size I am now and the medical people involved(including surgeon) didn’t mention anything about this as far as I recall and I think I would have remembered?

    I don’t intend to go to her get togethers anymore but unfortunately she is attending a London event I am also going to next Sunday, but we will be in a neutral place(restuarant) and there will be quite a few others there. I will make sure I’m not seated anywhere near her, I think!

    Marion, UK

    • Wow, that’s awful. You might consider privately e-mailing or calling her to tell her that, as a guest, you didn’t feel right objecting to the things she said, but that comments about your weight, health, or eating and exercise habits are completely out of bounds and you will not be tolerating those in the future.

      Avoiding her completely works too.

  15. Its coming out more and more that the food the so called experts are selling and pushing, have chemicals in them designed to KEEP you fat and get you fatter. I bet if they started making real food, many would lose weight automatically. No Im not talking about MickeyDs , Im talking about things put in the stuff on the grocery store shelves. I try hard to eat real food and organic when I can. I grow some of my own and can and dehydrate it too. Ive never been really thin, but I have been thinner. But since Im almost 60 now I just tell people, Im filled with life. Thats my excuse and Im sticking to it! :)

  16. I absolutely loathe the attitude that a person’s weight is evidence of their health. There is absolutely NO correlation between the two. It’s especially infuriating when you’ve lost weight and have a healthy lifestyle — but a 100+ loss doesn’t happen overnight. I’ve lost almost 60 lbs, I work out and eat well. But I still weigh over 250 lbs. So, yes, I know there are people who look at me and make a snap judgment based on that, not having any idea of what my habits are and assuming the worst just because of what I look like.

  17. Ragen,

    I’d like to point out someone on the other end of the spectrum to you –


    This model insists she’s tried everything to *gain* weight and hasn’t been able to. I look at her pictures, and if I didn’t read the accompanying text, I would assume this was a woman who starved herself for the thin model ideal. Turns out just the opposite – she grew up in Romania, where weight (which means you’re from a rich family) and was taunted as a child for being too skinny. She says she’s “finally comfortable in [her] own skin.”

    I pimped your blog while commenting on the article in my facebook. :)


    • Hi Ro!

      Thank you for pointing this out. I know some women who are really thin who have this issue and they get treated really poorly.


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